We need to talk about Mastodon gGmbH. They are the main developers of Mastodon's server software & official mobile apps, they own mastodon.social and Mastodon's trademarks. Their behaviour is inexplicably going in two totally opposite directions.
A couple of years ago they started promoting mastodon.social on the official apps while downplaying other servers, causing their server to grow while other servers shrank. Mastodon.social is currently about 28.7% of the active Fediverse and growing.
For comparison, another major server mas.to is just 1.2% of the active Fediverse. Mastodon.social is about twenty-four times bigger.
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FediThing
in reply to FediThing • • •If mastodon.social carries on growing at the expense of others, the Fedi will soon be in danger, here's why: fedi.tips/its-a-really-bad-ide…
At the same time, Mastodon's server devs are creating brilliant features to help decentralise the Fediverse. The v4.5.0 release will auto-federate all replies in threads, greatly helping smaller servers.
The good stuff will be pointless if mastodon.social keeps growing. It's as if Mastodon gGmbH isn't sure what it wants: does it want to build the world's only truly decentralised social network, or does it want to make a centralised social network which is structurally destined to enshittify?
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Mastodon.social is not a good way to join Mastodon. If you’re already on it, you might want to move your account to a different Mastodon server. | Fedi.Tips – An Unofficial Guide to Mastodon and the Fediverse
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FediThing
in reply to FediThing • • •This is NOT a difficult situation to solve.
There is a really easy solution: keep recommending one server for people who don't like choice, but regularly rotate it so growth is spread out. The app could have a button saying "Join mas.to" instead of "Join mastodon.social", for example.
The app makers could choose a pool of reliable general servers with track records going back many years (some are listed here: fedi.garden/servers-sorted-by-…) and recommend one of these on the front page of the app. They could then regularly change which one is recommended, so that each one in the reliable pool gradually gets a share of new signups.
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Servers sorted by founding year | Fedi.Garden
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FediThing
in reply to FediThing • • •By regularly rotating the recommended server, it would be just as easy for non-technical people to join the Fediverse but the growth would be spread out much more evenly and keep the Fedi protected from the dangers that come with centralisation.
Mastodon gGmbH's brilliant work on the server software would make more sense if they also rotated the recommended server on their apps.
Why isn't Mastodon gGmbH doing this? It's not technically difficult, they could make this change with just a few clicks and it would make a huge difference in keeping the Fediverse safe from takeover.
Hopefully someone at Mastodon gGmbH reads this 🙏
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lashman
in reply to FediThing • • •Oblomov reshared this.
ladyteruki
in reply to lashman • • •Oblomov reshared this.
lashman
in reply to ladyteruki • • •Laurens 🧢 🐐 🔻
in reply to lashman • • •reshared this
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lashman
in reply to Laurens 🧢 🐐 🔻 • • •FediThing
in reply to lashman • • •@lashman @ElBeeToots @ladyteruki
If the old server doesn't shut down and you don't delete your old account, the old toots don't disappear, they remain intact and (if you follow the advice in the guide at fedi.tips/transferring-your-ma…) they forward people to your new account.
I know moving posts would be best, but that's a huge undertaking technically compared to recommending a different server, so I'm trying to give priority on the easiest most effective stuff to do first 🙂
Transferring your Mastodon account to another server | Fedi.Tips – An Unofficial Guide to Mastodon and the Fediverse
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ladyteruki
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to ladyteruki • • •@ladyteruki @lashman @ElBeeToots
Ah sorry, did I misunderstand? Wasn't intentional, apologies 😦
ladyteruki
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to ladyteruki • • •@ladyteruki @lashman @ElBeeToots
No worries 🙂
ladyteruki
in reply to lashman • • •George B
in reply to lashman • • •@lashman
@jonny has a proposal for this:
neuromatch.social/@jonny/11537…
jonny (good kind)
2025-10-15 05:24:42
wizzwizz4
in reply to George B • • •@gbargoud @lashman Oh, the same @jonny who did #FetchAllReplies? github.com/mastodon/mastodon/p… github.com/mastodon/documentat…
Btw, sneakers-the-rat is not associated with Mastodon gGmbH. I'm not sure whether this explicates @FediThing's inexplicably.
Add Fetch All Replies Part 1: Backend by sneakers-the-rat · Pull Request #32615 · mastodon/mastodon
GitHubjonny (good kind)
in reply to wizzwizz4 • • •@gbargoud @lashman
Currently negotiating over an acceptable impl for base masto, won't have time to write it for a few weeks, but it'll happen. I think inability to move is one of the biggest weaknesses of the fedi (even if some software supports it, this is one thing that does require a standard)
FediThing
in reply to jonny (good kind) • • •@jonny @wizzwizz4 @gbargoud @lashman
Oh wow, an honour indeed! Thank you and so well done for the work on the "fetch all replies", that's a real breakthrough! 👏
jonny (good kind)
in reply to FediThing • • •Aurin Azadî
in reply to FediThing • • •I guess a problem could be the different server rules.
But aside from that I absolutely see your point.
Ein Köhler
in reply to FediThing • • •To add to your proposal:
It could also be a random server from a list of approved servers.
Seems a bit easier than overwhelming a different server each month ^^
Also did you ask them? Write them a mail!
Petra van Cronenburg
in reply to FediThing • • •Ein Köhler
in reply to FediThing • • •@andypiper
Hello Mastodon gGmbH!
The person i'm replying to has a pretty reasonably question for you and i think a pretty good proposal.
( I'm sure you heard this question a few times already, but it would be really cool if you'd answer )
Andy Piper
in reply to Ein Köhler • • •@coalburner3000 hey there! Thanks for tagging me in to this - I see the posts from @FediThing and I love (and share) their passion for the #fediverse community 👍🏻
There’s a *lot* that can be said on this - more than fits in a single post! I want you to know that the team is aware of all of these asks and suggestions, and a more complete response *will* come along in the near future - stay tuned to our blog 👀
Brother Soul
in reply to FediThing • • •yes, Yes, & YES.
Brother
Daniel
in reply to FediThing • • •indyradio
in reply to Daniel • • •here's one - (spaces inserted)
@ daniel_cl @ mastodon.cl
indyradio
in reply to Daniel • • •good bye jackass
indyradio
in reply to FediThing • • •They will laugh at you, and you will gradually be harassed by more Nazis until you hopefully shut up and leave.
That was my experience anyway.
There is no rule expect for the political and economic dominance of the GMBH.
Period.
The rest are routinely trashed, there really is no rule but that.
deutrino
in reply to FediThing • • •they're not doing it because Gargron's primary goal remains what it has always been: to have direct control of as big a social media fiefdom as possible.
the pattern is very clear and very consistent to people who've been here nearly a decade and have been paying attention to the dev process of Mastodon.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to FediThing • • •I have to disagree. Mastodon gGmbH are focussed on ensuring users have a good experience. Most new users aren't that bothered about where they join.
As the developer of a piece of software I would not feel comfortable directing users to a server with potentially arbitrary moderation.
Improving migration tools is, in my view, much more valuable than adding buttons to join other servers.
Why Not Zoidberg? 🦑
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to Why Not Zoidberg? 🦑 • • •@WhyNotZoidberg Please share examples of their arbitrary moderation.
But respectfully, you are making my own point for me: imagine if the app signed new users up by default to a server that blocks mastodon.social.
Imagine the confusion for that user who has never used mastodon before. It is just an unacceptable first experience.
FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris @WhyNotZoidberg
Imagine the confusion when Mastodon turns out to be exactly like Twitter because it's centralised.
What exactly is the point of all the massive volunteer efforts to promote the Fediverse if Mastodon gGmbH is going to centralise it? Why should people be donating for that?
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to FediThing • • •@WhyNotZoidberg none of the three people in this conversation are on mastodon.social. There is decentralisation and it is built in as a feature. The situation is in no way comparable to twitter.
When it comes to social networks, you have to balance ideological purity with usability. The fact that you have completely dismissed genuine concerns about usability show you that you are not in a position to do that.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris @WhyNotZoidberg
Try using mas.to and then try using mastodon.social and tell me that mas.to is somehow worse.
Please do that, then comment.
I have actually done that.
Don't go by theory, go by empirical observation.
Why Not Zoidberg? 🦑
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •the goal of Mastodon.social is to become too big to block.
If you want a "federated" social network with only one main instance just use Bluesky.
The whole point with Mastodon is that it doesn't need to grow. It is not a network that has to make a profit, so growing for the sake of growing is bad.
Why Not Zoidberg? 🦑
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •BlokForge
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris It is crucial to not use one server for a federated network. I see you moderation, and "not bothered" argument just as an excuse.
And you mention good UX but then later, new users who aren't "bother where they join" should bother to migrate to other server because they suddenly care where they joined?
There can be made a pool of servers chosen by public that will be on rotation, I would argue even that mastodon.social should cool off for a year at least.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to BlokForge • • •@blokforge That is literally what i said, yes. Users who have joined with little knowledge will gain knowledge over time and move, which is why migration tools need improvement.
I agree that we shouldn't centralised, but I wouldn't be comfortable sending people to servers without reasonable moderation and sustainability policies.
BlokForge
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris I read in other replies, .social is not great with that also and gets banned by some instances. Who is gmbh to decide what are policies good or bad ?
And as other people mentioned instances can be choosen, nobody requires all instances to be promoted. It's an issue that is solvable. I just don't see gmbh going in that way and just preserving power for itself.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to BlokForge • • •@blokforge they are the developers of the software.
People's experience of the fediverse evolves over time. Sending a newcomer to a server that might block other popular servers, which results in that new user being unable to communicate with their friends, is a non-starter.
BlokForge
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •.social instance is not arbiter of anything, nor should be. Only reason they are powerfull is because of centralization that devs built in when they put .social as main instance. the gmail of fediverse.
FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris
None of this is true. The moderation on e.g. mas.to is as good or better than on mastodon.social. I have used both instances for years.
"Most new users aren't that bothered about where they join."
So why send them to the biggest server? Why centralise the platform?
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to FediThing • • •because the mastodon developers can't guarantee users on instances outside it's control a good experience.
Other commenters have raised, for example, that they defederated from mastodon.social: imagine the impact on the user experience of a new user.
I can't speak to the readiness of specific instances, but I can say that the developers are right to think carefully about what the default experience for users should look like.
FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris
"because the mastodon developers can't guarantee users on instances outside it's control a good experience."
Again, just not true in reality. Centralisation makes moderation worse, not better.
Mastodon.social is already too large for them to moderate properly. Admins on other servers are constantly having to clean up after the lack of moderation on mastodon.social
It's the centralisation that causes the worst possible experience, because there is no way to have enough of a moderator to user ratio to have good moderation.
Decentralisation means more human moderators per person.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •What exactly do you think will happen if a majority of users are on one server?
It will make it more and more difficult to moderate mastodon.social, they will receive less and less help from volunteers, they will have to monetise, advertisers, VCs etc will come along and offer them money, and it will go down the path of enshittification.
The ENTIRE POINT of Mastodon is NOT to centralise. They said so themselves when they launched the project and called for donations.
Centralised social media leads to stuff like this: theguardian.com/technology/202…
Could there possibly be worse moderation than links to multiple genocides?
Rohingya sue Facebook for £150bn over Myanmar genocide
Dan Milmo (The Guardian)Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to FediThing • • •again, I think you are underestimating and thinking the worst of an excellent group of individuals.
Decentralisation is a core feature at the heart of Mastodon's design.
FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •"Decentralisation is a core feature at the heart of Mastodon's design."
Not if it has most people on one instance. That is the opposite.
A few years ago before they promoted mastodon.social as default they were on about 10% of network, then 15%, last year 20% and now approaching 30%. Soon they will be a majority.
At that point, they can simply switch off federation and monetise and no one can stop them. If they run out of cash they may even feel obligated to do so.
This is based on bitter experience of many FOSS and libre projects turning to shit. Network effect from centralisation makes this danger worse.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris
If you are willing to trust the people who run a centralised network, why the hell are you going to all the additional technical cost of decentralising it?
The entire point of decentralisation is to prevent it being possible so you don't have to trust someone not to sell out.
Jason Petersen (he)
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •PaulaToThePeople 😷
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris "because the mastodon developers can't guarantee users on instances outside it's control"
it's spelled monetize, not guarantee.
Woodfric
in reply to FediThing • • •@jmaris
"So why send them to the biggest server? Why centralise the platform?"
Easier to monetize once the features are in place.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to Woodfric • • •FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •They didn't build it on their own, they built it with volunteers and bits of other FOSS and donations and huge vast armies of people giving them good will.
When you centralise and take possession of the network those people built, the good will disappears.
I'm going by WHAT THEY SAID THEMSELVES when they started the project. They are breaking their own stated principles.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to FediThing • • •@wulfric
I never said they built it on their own. they are not centralising it: your choice has not been taken away from you, but sane defaults for new users is key. It seems you can't understand that then there is little point continuing the discussion.
FediThing
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •They ARE centralising it, they're knowingly promoting a server that is approaching a majority of the network.
At that point it is no longer meaningfully decentralised because they would have direct control over most of it.
"sane defaults for new users is key"
Are you saying mas.to is somehow "not sane" for example?
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
in reply to FediThing • • •Woodfric
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris
"a handful of amazing people using software that they built"
Isn't that exactly what you said?
Woodfric
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •They are the ones implementing the enshittification features like tracking URLs. I'm just watching the writing on the wall.
PaulaToThePeople 😷
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris New users might not care, but active users and especially moderators care.
And not being comfortable directing users to a server with potentially bad moderation is no excuse for directing them to a server with intentionally bad moderation.
Daniel Gomes
in reply to FediThing • • •Great suggestions. You should email them directly.
I don’t think they have pushed Mastodon.social on purpose to undermine others, but rather to make it easier for the average non techie user to join Mastodon. The average user has no idea about different servers, it would scare then away.
The improvements they are making prove they are in full support of the community. Perhaps they’ve been unsure how to solve the issue so they likely will welcome your email @Mastodon
Max Lee
in reply to FediThing • • •As much as I would love seeing rotating servers I doubt that's realistically possible for liability reasons, both towards the app stores and the law.
And not providing a default server at all leads to bad usability. I personally think that the approach neeqs to be different: More local and online groups need to provide their own servers for members so they can use them/switch to them.
(And mastodon.social will have financial trouble eventually anyways if thet grow too big and are forced to find a solution for the overcrowding...)
FediThing
in reply to Max Lee • • •@the_moep
No, that's not true.
Mastodon gGmbH used to have rotating servers until a couple of years ago.
And they haven't stopped people using other servers, they've just emphasised mastodon.social while hiding the others behind "pick another server". If there was liability issues they would not have the pick another option at all.
Max Lee
in reply to FediThing • • •I honestly doubt it's that black and white. While I can understand that some app stores would decide it by exactly what is in the code of the app the actual law tends to go by intention.
And not advertising other platforms in an obvious way could potentially make the advertisement non-significant enough to not make them liable for the content included in it. (At least I don't see any advertisement and liability disclaimer next to the server selection in the app itself which would be required by law if they thought it was advertisement what they are doing with linking to third-party services)
indyradio
in reply to Max Lee • • •@the_moep
No. There does not need to be a default derver.
This is contrary to the idea of decentralization, and that IS what you want with Gag ron
Please, spare me the cheap apologia for bullshit.
Max Lee
in reply to indyradio • • •@indyradio
I'm sorry, but having tech-illerate people find a compatible fediverse service on the web before even being able to use the app will make them just not use it. Of course I'm all for educating them about that they have a choice but the reality is that choice is not wanted at that point and offering them an easy way to experience the Fediverse is a valuable service to our movement as a whole.
And if the goal is to actually tranform how social media works then usability needs to be front and center, not an afterthought. So we need to identify what is stopping the Mastodon app from offering alternative servers in the app e.g. in a rotation or a list and solve those issues. Ignoring those issues and blaming the people that are fighting to better the whole situation will not help us, it hurts us.
The issues that I can instantly think of along with potential solutions:
Of course there's also another, more obvious solution for solving the whole issue imo: Transform the Mastodon gGmbH do an e.V. (registered association) or Genossenschaft (cooperative) or even move it into public EU management (once it's a real democracy) to allow democratic control of both the development and operation. (Unfortunately I kinda doubt that will happen but imo. on paper it's the best option)
BlokForge
in reply to FediThing • • •Have no idea, and I had same thoughts as you regarding centralization of masto.
Probably the real reason is because they want to have the most power over the network.
Leonardo Ferreira Fontenelle
in reply to FediThing • • •Which general-purpose, multilingual instances have open inscriptions (without a moderator having to approve new members) and want this kind of attention?
(edited: typo)
FediThing
in reply to Leonardo Ferreira Fontenelle • • •@lffontenelle
I've got a site at fedi.garden which recommends well-run smaller servers. If you want well-run servers with larger numbers of people too try joinmastodon.org/servers
Fedi.Garden
fedi.gardenLeonardo Ferreira Fontenelle
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to FediThing • • •p.s. About people saying "We can trust them, stop being paranoid"...
This isn't a personal attack on Mastodon gGmbH or Eugen or any of the people currently there. They do seem nice people.
But are they going to be doing this forever? What happens when they leave? What happens when they run low on money?
Most of us know projects that went downhill when ownership changed, or when the project became so dependent on a particular sponsor that the sponsor effectively owned them.
The idea of decentralisation is to avoid these bad situations by spreading the network out so it can never end up in any single person or group's hands.
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FediThing
in reply to FediThing • • •p.p.s. Also, the really REALLY correct answer to the question "Don't you trust Mastodon gGmbH?" is that trust shouldn't be going in one direction if lots of volunteers are working together on building a network.
If Mastodon gGmbH is saying that there is not any single server anywhere on the Fediverse that they trust to recommend, even the ones that have been going reliably and responsibly for many years, what does that say about Mastodon gGmbH as an organisation?
Does Mastodon gGmbH only trust things they control directly? If so, why are they expecting other people to trust them?
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Conny Duck
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to Conny Duck • • •@ConnyDuck
Thank you, that means a lot 🙏
bazkie 👩🏼💻 bitplanes 🎵
in reply to FediThing • • •thank you!! 🙏
"Why isn't Mastodon gGmbH doing this? It's not technically difficult, they could make this change with just a few clicks and it would make a huge difference in keeping the Fediverse safe from takeover."
because, I believe, people get addicted to having power. they're like.. "we could decentralize it more.. buuuut.. it's kinda nice to have this influence for now.. to steer things in the right directions if we need to.. we'll decentralize it more later.."
that is my theory, of course; I can't prove this is the train of thought, but this basically always happens in almost every power structure, no matter how benevolent it starts out.
at some point, you need to jank the power away from these people, no matter how nice they seem.
Parade du Grotesque 💀
in reply to FediThing • • •Mastodon gGmbH had discussions with Meta, under NDA, that were never detailed. That was around the time Meta launched Threads, their 'Xitter killer'.
They are clearly infected with the 'growth at all costs' mentality of many startups, polluting the Fediverse with countless spammers & scammers.
They CANNOT be trusted and this is clearly yet another step in the wrong direction.
I will add that they are developing 'features' that are clearly toxic instead of moderation tools.
Jay Grant 🏳️⚧️
in reply to FediThing • • •masto developers aren't trusted because they're not trustworthy. Marginalized and harassed communities have been begging them for years to work on safety features.
AFAICT, Masto acts like they want to centralize their decentralized service. Which is why there are other, better Fediverse services.
Calligrafae
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to FediThing • • •p.p.p.s. If someone wants to do something quick and simple to help stop centralisation, and if you're comfortable using Github, give a thumbs up in these issues on the official apps:
iOS app
github.com/mastodon/mastodon-i…
Android app
github.com/mastodon/mastodon-a…
Please don't propose to use the flagship instance by default
stemy2 (GitHub)Fish Id Wardrobe
in reply to FediThing • • •> Does Mastodon gGmbH only trust things they control directly? If so, why are they expecting other people to trust them?
DING DING DING DING
yep.
of course if you're a geeky coder person, or even a group of them, liaising with others may not be in your comfort zone.
but it's still the job in this case.
Lauma Pret 🕸️
in reply to FediThing • • •Morgan ⚧️
in reply to FediThing • • •Nick Silkey 📻 N5ILK 🪓🪵 🪣💧
in reply to FediThing • • •it's open source. Propose a patch perhaps. There you can make your case for such a change. 👀
I'm not saying this is bulletproof! 💙 But it might help advance the ball in accomplishing your goal of balancing the inbound funnel to fedi. ✌️
FediThing
in reply to Nick Silkey 📻 N5ILK 🪓🪵 🪣💧 • • •@nicksilkey
I opened an issue about it on the official iOS app as soon as it started happening in April 2023:
github.com/mastodon/mastodon-i…
Someone else opened a similar issue at the same time on the official Android app:
github.com/mastodon/mastodon-a…
Neither issue has been acted upon.
Please don't propose to use the flagship instance by default
stemy2 (GitHub)Becca 🌳🚀🛀
in reply to FediThing • • •Jo - pièce de résistance
in reply to FediThing • • •indyradio
in reply to FediThing • • •is full of shit, and additionally is structured so it allows 1/3 of all income to go to the CEO.
Repeat that a few times, then tell me what you think.
Daniel Gultsch
in reply to FediThing • • •I have no opinion on the Mastodon gGmbH but picking a default server is so, so much more nuanced and compliacted than you make it out to be.
I'm in a similar boat with the #Conversations_im Jabber/XMPP client and the conversations.im default server. We started running that not because we wanted to run a server but because users requested that.
How long a server has been around has zero indication on how long it will be around.
GinevraCat
in reply to FediThing • • •Chaos Agent Spectre
in reply to FediThing • • •one idea I think that would be much more user friendly and help bump other servers would actually be a small survey upon attempting to sign up.
I only found my instance after already making an account on mastodon.social, because I didn't realize how the fediverse fully worked at the time. Had I been presented a small survey asking my primary language, my interests, preferred local community size (while also explaining what a community/instance is in the simplest terms possible), and how active I'd like myself or the community to be, I most likely would have ended up in my current instance on the first try. Should only be 5 questions max, and each question should be able to have some sort of relational link to data statistics about an instance.
Let instances choose to opt in to being part of the survey results, so some people can still stay more closed off if they want to.
Carlo Gubitosa
in reply to FediThing • • •The VHS Wizard 🦝📼🧙
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to The VHS Wizard 🦝📼🧙 • • •@thevhswizard
I just manually curate it, there is no automated process of any kind.
I can update your listing if you can let me know the exact character limit? Is it 1000?
I use the info listed in a server's desscription so if they don't mention the character limit I can't list it.
The VHS Wizard 🦝📼🧙
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to The VHS Wizard 🦝📼🧙 • • •@thevhswizard
Thanks, it's updated! 🙏
indyradio
in reply to FediThing • • •too late, bub -
soon as the CEO finds out you exist, you will have troubles like I have.
He had nitwits follow me from the instances where I was banned, to pile on, continuously report, and harass other admins so I would be banned on other systems.
The Greeks don't buy their crap, they make honest use of the software to the extent possible.
Baral'heia Stormdancer ΘΔ🐲
in reply to FediThing • • •Gerard Cunningham ✒️
in reply to FediThing • • •indyradio
in reply to FediThing • • •I see a repeat of familiar programmed behavior by a GMBH which is not to be trusted. @fou
Herman 🇪🇺🇺🇦🇾🇪🍋
in reply to FediThing • • •Darrell Bowles
in reply to FediThing • • •Szewek
in reply to FediThing • • •Speaking of mastodon.social, why the gGmbH German non-profit hosts its server in San Francisco, United States?
fedidb.com/servers/mastodon.so…
indyradio
in reply to FediThing • • •Can you reveal the secret?
You'd have to go back prior to 2015, while it seemed quiet.
trainguyrom
in reply to FediThing • • •see, I get why they do that. It is a massive risk to an organization to tell users to make an account on another organization's server that they have zero control over moderation, uptime, privacy policy, future changes to the above etc. especially if account migration is a hassle that doesn't fully migrate everything.
But also the fediverse needs as even of a distribution of servers as possible for good network health, and by pushing users who aren't certain only onto a single server a good chunk of them will remain on that server indefinitely thereby weighting the Fediverse towards a handful of specific servers.
I think in the long term, improving account migration can help mitigate all of that risk and enable a rotating whitelist of open-application Mastadon servers for new users to blindly click join on
Calicosine
in reply to FediThing • • •Number6
in reply to FediThing • • •In that screenshot, they're not hiding other options -- your circle is! It says "Pick another server" right there.
I guess various servers need to promote their particular advantages. I know for myself, I get tired of the 500 character limit.
txtx 🇪🇺
in reply to FediThing • • •I don't see a problem with Mastodon promoting their own server over others.
The fediverse isn't only Mastodon: it's other compatible ActivityPub apps and communities. Pixelfed is a good example.
Other communities/servers should promote their communities in their own way, it should be up to them to do so.
uginho
in reply to FediThing • • •Good points, as exemplified by me, joining mastodon.social out of laziness and incompetence. I do intend to migrate, though I haven't gotten around to it..
I had hoped the legal form of Mastodon gGmbH would protect us users somewhat from the general enshittification of centralized platforms, as there are some legal strings attached to maintain the "g" in gGmbh. I'm not a lawyer though, so idk.
Why not ask them directly, maybe they would like to comment?
@Mastodon
@Gargron
axoneko
in reply to FediThing • • •it's funny because I got banned from mastodon.social for literally no reason.
I moved my followers from another instance and the next day my account was banned, I was not able to move my followers back to the previous instance, so I had to start again.
I don't post anything NSFW, hate content or anything like that, just gaming and anime.
Mush
in reply to FediThing • • •@FediThing, мне не очень понятно чем крупный инстанс может навредить. Как будто бы Fediverse нужно для сообществ, а не блоггеров. А потому сообщества могут поднять сервер себе и не волноваться что происходит на крупных инстансах.
Если сервера mastodon.social могут выдержать такое крупное число юзеров, то классно же. Зачем за это их винить? Возможно, такой масштаб продемонстрирует новые явления, которых раньше не было в Fediverse и откроет новые направления развития.
@Stoic
in reply to FediThing • • •Fabian【ファビアン】🏳️🌈
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
Unknown parent • • •@regendans
Yes, but new people aren't going to see those because they will almost all just search app stores for "Mastodon" and see the official app.
The official app is the crucial way of affecting which server new people join.
ComputerNut43
in reply to FediThing • • •About just one button that says "pick server" that way the end user needs to choose and just like st the grocery store. If they pick your item, you win!
Rich Puchalsky ⩜⃝
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
Unknown parent • • •@killick @txtx
This isn't mastodon.social just dominating Mastodon, it's mastdon.social dominating the entire Fediverse.
Mastodon.social currently has about 28.7% of all active Fedi accounts including Pixelfed.
A lot of us have put many hours of free labour and/or money towards Mastodon's software development, helping people get onto Mastodon and how to use it. This was on the assumption that Mastodon gGmbH wanted to build a decentralised network, which is what they claimed they did (here's their own promo video: fedi.video/w/cbQE3NRw76FayQCSd… ).
Why should they benefit from our free labour to build something they control?
born2chill
in reply to FediThing • • •I believe the main issue here is that it's hard to figure out which server operators are reliable and will provide long-term, stable and standardized instance hosting. On which basis would Mastodon gGmbH recommend servers?
They would need some kind of due-diligence or know-your-server-operator process, including somewhat regular check-ins with said operators to ensure they don't send possible users to "bad" instances.
All of which is very heavy on resources - cost and time wise.
So I guess for now they opted to just do it themselves. Would also match their latest offering at joinmastodon.org/hosting .
Managed Mastodon
joinmastodon.orgFediThing
in reply to born2chill • • •@b2c
"it's hard to figure out which server operators are reliable and will provide long-term, stable and standardized instance hosting"
No, it's not.
There are servers that have been going since 2017 reliably and with good moderation. I specifically mention these in the thread.
You can look some of these up at fedi.garden/servers-sorted-by-…
Servers sorted by founding year | Fedi.Garden
fedi.gardenarosano 🇩🇰 🇮🇱
in reply to FediThing • • •arosano 🇩🇰 🇮🇱
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to arosano 🇩🇰 🇮🇱 • • •@arosano
Exactly!
E. Arda Yavaş
in reply to FediThing • • •hallunke23 🇺🇦
in reply to FediThing • • •They should approach this matter in the same way as CCC did with the jabber.ccc.de Jabber server: Close registrations, ask users to decentralise.
#decentralise @FediThing
Hugs4friends ♾🇺🇦 🇵🇸😷
in reply to FediThing • • •Sensitive content
Cyrox
in reply to FediThing • • •DieMadColonizer
in reply to FediThing • • •0xDECAFBAD
in reply to FediThing • • •Astounds me that as the also-ran of also-ran social media platforms, the denizens of Fedi still spend their time stabbing themselves in the back 😡 This “OMG mastodon.social will kill Mastodon!!!!!” was all the rage 2 1/2 years ago … and here we all are still waiting patiently for the Fedipocalypse.
There are plenty of things wrong with Mastodon, but the default server selection is waaaay down the list.
Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO
Unknown parent • • •Woodfric
in reply to Jordan Maris 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 #NAFO • • •@jmaris @lexinova
If they aren't intentionally steering Mastodon towards the commercial cliff, they might want to step back and look forward.
My interactions with one of the devs was less than pleasant because I saw the feature being touted as a major step towards being like X and Meta.
Riquiñez
in reply to FediThing • • •Konstruct (advancing)
in reply to FediThing • • •Red 🟥
in reply to FediThing • • •Parola filtrata: nsfw
I think masto instances getting as large as .social is an issue (especially for .social) the larger the userbase of an instance the more slop/bots/AI trash that slips past moderation.
I had .social blocked on my old account because the bulk of what i got was shitty takes and nsfw bot accounts. thats just twitter in an elephant costume!
I think most reasonable and creative folks are or will be using a smaller instance,
Don Ray
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to Don Ray • • •@donray
Mastodon.online is also owned by Mastodon gGmbH so in that sense it is centralising, because they have control over both it and mastodon.social.
Don Ray
in reply to FediThing • • •Manda
in reply to FediThing • • •I am glad to know this, and yeah, I think the decentralization premise is really important.
I am one of the non-technical people referenced in your thread.
I didn't onboard through mobile apps, but I left my first instance because I started having difficulties with my trending feed and had no clue why or who to talk to about it.
I moved to the .social because I figured it was going to be more stable due to higher numbers.
I still don't know how to fully navigate the servers here
FediThing
in reply to Manda • • •@lucyruthe
If it's any help, I've tried to collect together a site with well-run reliable servers at fedi.garden
There's a section with them listed by the year they were founded, so you can see which ones have a long track record of stability: fedi.garden/servers-sorted-by-…
Higher numbers can cause less stability because it means it's harder to moderate, as there is a lower ratio of moderator to user.
"I still don't know how to fully navigate the servers here"
If you think of it as a provider, sort of like your phone provider? Once you're on one server, you can talk to people on other servers seamlessly 🙂
Fedi.Garden
fedi.gardenManda
in reply to FediThing • • •That's a great resource. Thanks!
Though it still feels like I need to be inside the system in order to figure out options.
Provider bit makes sense to me. It's the knowing the options in advance that feels complicated.
FediThing
in reply to Manda • • •@lucyruthe
Is there something I could do to make it easier or more friendly to use?
For example, would it help if there was just a single server suggestion on the front page? (If there was a single suggestion, it would be a general server that has been around for a while.)
Manda
in reply to FediThing • • •I appreciate your helpfulness!
I kinda feel settled on the current platform, so I'm not looking to move right now.
Not savvy enough to know the options, but this feels like something that would be useful to people looking to get started. It was the getting started bit where I wasn't even sure what I should be looking for.
Whatever inventory page I was looking at from the outside was super basic. I suspect it's the "outside the system" information that is harder to come by.
FediThing
in reply to Manda • • •@lucyruthe
Okay, fair enough 🙂 Good luck with whichever server you use!
If I could just ask one more quick thing though as it's a really interesting point you raised:
By "outside the system" do you mean outside the Mastodon-branded apps and Mastodon-branded websites?
Manda
in reply to FediThing • • •FediThing
in reply to Manda • • •Ah, that's interesting, thank you 🙏
(I run an account at @FediTips and a site at fedi.tips which try to help new people, so this is really useful info!)
Fedi.Tips – An Unofficial Guide to Mastodon and the Fediverse
fedi.tipsindyradio
in reply to FediThing • • •If the Fedi was worth 2 cents, certainly something like this would get more than a handful of visits.
Watch, almost no action here. If it was a link from my website, the Nazis would grab the IP address and start a full out attack, and prevent any social media interaction.
No one else will post this either, or at least you will not see it.
kafeneio.social/@indyradio/115…
indyradio (@indyradio@kafeneio.social)
indyradio (kafeneio)