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Initial response to @pluralistic regarding #FreeOurFeeds

Want to thank Cory Doctorow for answering questions about his support for Free Our Feeds here:

pluralistic.net/2025/01/14/con…

What follows is a response in the form of a list of concerns about FOF.

Cory rightly took exception to the "scolding" tone of some of the discussion so far. It is hoped that here, at least, we can keep it focused on the substance of this issue.

So, here goes...

1/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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1. Primary goal seems to be to build a second relay for Bluesky so people can exit the corporate site if it becomes enshittified. Necessarily this will involve building undemonstrated technology effectively for Bluesky that they should have done more than promise will work. So it becomes public funding of corporate owned technology.

2/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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1. (cont.) There is no guarantee that it will work. It depends on cooperation of Bluesky. Even once implemented there is no guarantee it will fulfill it's function as the company will certainly retain a myriad ways of hobbling the interface should they desire to do so. Bottom line, is it an escape hatch to nowhere?

3/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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2. The technology itself. If you read Christine Lemmer-Webber's analysis of the AT Protocol it seems like the protocol itself is incompatible with the FOF purpose of independent decentralization of nodes. Certainly not low cost decentralization.

4/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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2. (cont) Understand BSky pushes back on this, but the fact that they have not demonstrated this capability and the prospective FOF cost of millions of dollars to make a second relay makes it seem like Christine is right. In any case, why should the public do this before the company first demonstrates the capability?

5/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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3. FOF Personnel is tech and AI heavy, and with the exception of you, does not include clear advocates for open truly public systems. The recent direction of the Mozilla Foundation and their top line involvement is cause for concern.

6/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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4. Have not been able to locate any documentation on this foundation other than the splashy, but thin, website. What is the legal structure? Who are the officers? Any financials? Is there any specific mission statement? Implementation plan? Where does the money donated go? Who/what is it spent on? Etc.

7/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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5. Bluesky corporate structure. Bluesky represents itself as owned by Jay Graber and the employees, when it reality it is owned by a who's who of Silicon Valley VC's and crypto entities like Blockchain Capital. They are about to close a new funding round led by Bain Capital expected to value the company at $700M. What about all of this makes this the place to invest public money to escape billionaires?

8/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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6. Sucking money and attention from public social media. We are at a critical moment. As a result of the election, the public has become aware of the power of billionaires to shape opinion. We have a moment in time to help move people onto public platforms which are truly defensible. Bluesky is another corporate trap, where people are not safe from the same thing that has happened in previous cycles of enshittification.

9/n

#FreeOurFeeds

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6. (cont) It is not clear FOF can provide that safety for reasons stated above. So, the fear is funding this multiyear, super expensive effort with public money actually detracts, distracts and takes funding away from the absolutely necessary goal of actually building public social media, effectively becoming a poison pill.

#FreeOurFeeds

10/10

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on this one, I would raise the counter point that Mastodon is in no way ready for the heavy lift of a significant migration. We've a long way to go in terms of trust and safety. It's far too easy to abuse people here.

More generally, we could do with a more inviting culture, too. At least that's something non technical we can all work on.

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@Stu

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exactly. This is just an grift from some hustlers. They are currently in AI because that's where the big money is currently. Pocketing 30 mil over a few years sounds like a splendid idea to such people if you need to do, well, jack shit for it.

Edit: 7 out of 9 are AI: New_ Public: rockefellerfoundation.org/gran… Mozilla, linkedin.com/in/sherifea/detai… and two has AI in their company name.

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@GhostOnTheHalfShell
Hadn't thought of that, but it would be good if they did. Suspect that just kicking the can is working for them, so why change?
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@GhostOnTheHalfShell
Not that much money has been raised yet. The GoFundMe lusts $39,000. So they have a way to go.

Still, $39,000 would be enough for several Fedi instances to operate for a year.

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@inquiline @GhostOnTheHalfShell

What is interesting is the website has no links to any backup documentation about the foundation.

Have not been able to find out anything about its directorship, structure, financials etc. beyond very general information on the website.

Also, the donate button takes you to a GoFundMe page, not any kind of secure Free Our Feeds transaction processing page.

So, agree it was hashed together quickly, and there may be less there than they are trying to project.

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Usually this type of org is used to 'sponsor' a group that is not legally allowed to raise donations because they do not have an entity with non-profit status.

Again, it looks like Feed Our Feeds is not really set up yet. Expect that the use of the first money will be to create a non-profit entity that can take donations directly.

This is all supposition.

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Agreed. They seem pretty far out over their skis. Another thing that is troubling is this glib plan to build a Bsky relay. Not sure what real engineering analysis could have gone into this, versus someone's cool idea of making Bsky distributed based on the company's marketing statements.
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@UlrikeHahn @inquiline @GhostOnTheHalfShell

Could be. Not sure why they would be connected, but it does seem like a lot of Silicon Valley types circling around. Maybe there is some grand plan. 🤷

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Ulrike Hahn
@inquiline @GhostOnTheHalfShell I had assumed the timing was forced by the new BS funding round and 700m valuation?
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@inquiline @GhostOnTheHalfShell which also shouldn't come necessarily as a surprise because projecting a grandeur that isn't there is the core value of the startup culture, which also happens to be Silicon Valley Tech Giants fundamentals.
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Ulrike Hahn
@inquiline @GhostOnTheHalfShell I have no idea about things business, so totally out if my depth here but my thought on reading the FoF thing was that it felt like a threat to the commercial value of BS the company. What would be worth 700m about BS if someone spun up a clone of the relay? Isn’t everyone already struggling to understand what they could make money with?

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to me, the structural problem is obvious. the relays mean there's a middleman while the fedi works like the open web. if one of these structures is to win the future of social media and truly dominate, how could anyone want anybody (as cool as they might be) to have that much power when it's totally unnecessary. to be between govts and media orgs and the public.

look at @mondoweiss. how much pressure would come down on that relay to censor reporting on #Gaza?

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@mondoweiss

so I think I now get what Cory and friends are planning here. it's an attack that they don't want to be too obvious about. maybe I shouldn't write this up. they're trying to kill BS but save the people first before it goes down. maybe.

liberal.city/@wjmaggos/1138330…


Thanks to @pluralistic, I guess I now better understand the frontal assault of #FreeOurFeeds on #bluesky. They're forcing the issue on the relay centralization. Either bs interoperates with them, or their refusal to do so and ability to replicate their whole network helps people to switch relays. It's like a hostile takeover. I don't understand the long term plan but if I'm understanding this correctly, I kinda like it. even though it seems like a fuck ton of money.

pocket.co/share/413cc705-73a5-…